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Greetings.

I am a Roman Rite Catholic who has been attending a Byzantine Church for 6 months. I love the liturgy and I have made the the Byzantine Church my parish. I hope my question wil not offend.

I am aware that babies are given communion by the priest who offers a few drops of the Precious Blood from the spoon into the babies' mouth. It only occured to me that toddlers who receive the Precious Body as well may choke if the host is dropped into the mouth. I noticed for the first time the priest give communion to two toddlers and the children's mouths had closed on the spoon. However, the spoon was not replaced and the same spoon was used for subsequent communicants. I don't want to be disrespectful, but I fear that this is not sanitary. Do you think the toddlers closed their mouths on the spoon unexpectedly or is this common practice in the Ruthenian Byzantine Church? I know (well, I hope) that most people have the good sense to stay home when they are ill, but toddlers get sick all the time and cannot often communicate their illness to their parents. Please advise.

Thank you and God bless,

Marc

Marc,

It's not unusual for visitors to do the same thing - in fact when we have groups visiting, Father ALWAYS makes a point of asking folks please not to chomp the spoon or make him play tug-of-war with it

When I've observed spoon-chomping, it's not uncommon for Father to stop a moment and wipe the spoon with the red cloth before proceeding.

If he doesn't, well, yes, it's probably a bit unhygienic, but I figure I risk more from using the office drinking fountain. If it worries you, sit in the front of the church, so you end up ahead in the communion line. (fresh spoon) it will also likely delight the pastor, who is probably accustomed to the phenomenon of folks sitting way in back as if the front of the church were radioactive.

Best,

Sharon

Dear Marc C.,

I do not feel that your post is disrespectful. I understand that the reason that the Holy blood was denied in the West for so many years was because of the vast numbers of people communing, and the accompanying, inevitable desecration.

In the East, both the bread and wine are mixed. The bread becomes so soft, it is almost not discernable, therefore, it is easily swallowable and digestable for a baby. I am aware that certain churches in the East drop the Eucharist in the mouth...I suppose I can see your concern for a baby choking from that practice. My brethren here whose churches administer that way will have to clarify that for you.

In my church, which is Greek Orthodox, I must admit that it is customary, both here and abroad, and always has been, for all to take the spoon in their mouths. We start communing from the time that we are babies like that. Sure, there have been faithful who have been worried about the transmission of disease. If one looks at it with purely secular eyes, this is absolutely understandable. However, we look upon the Eucharist as SO Holy (as do you) that you must look at it mystically. Obviously, for some, all one can say, is that it must be a great leap of faith.

Never, in one thousand two hundred years of the common spoon in the Greek church, has anyone fallen ill or died, despite plagues and epidemics because of the common spoon of the Eucharist. Our priest says that if you start thinking about it, and start fearing, you must put it out of your mind, pray, and cast aside the Evil One. Our priests also say, that if anyone would surely fall ill or die, it would be they, for they are required at the end of the liturgy to consume all the precious Eucharist that is left...after EVERYONE, has communed!!

I know that all this could sound somewhat gross, but as we both believe, this is the precious body and blood, the real presence of our Lord, which we are talking about, and thus, we must think of it as such.

Hope this clarifies things for you a bit.

In the Risen Christ,
Alice

Perhaps the following pages that address the question of disease and the common cup will be equally applicable to the question of the communion spoon. The bottom line is that the common cup entail no more risk than gathering in a public place.

Common cup and infection [anglican.ca]
Infection risks [anglican.ca]
Another opinion [spindleworks.com]

Hope these are helpful

If the mouth is opened properly and the communicant keeps their head lower than the chalice, the priest can simply turn the spoon over in the mouth, so that the Holy Gifts fall onto the tongue.

Spasi Khristos -
Mark, monk and sinner.

Do Greek Catholics/Byzantine Catholics add the zeon/warm water to the chalice before communion, thereby softening the solid particles?

Spasi Khristos -
Mark, monk and sinner.

Dear Father Mark,

Christ is Risen! Christos Voskrese! Christos Anesti!

Father, bless!

Is this the way that you commune?

I am starting to think that the GO do things terribly differently than their other Eastern counterparts.

I have communed in many GO parishes here in the U.S., and also have communed in Greece. I have never seen a deviation in Greek practice from taking the spoon in one's mouth.

I guess...whatever works. There was some talk a few years back from some liberal clergy here about changing to paper cups and the like (because of some laity fears, especially in the years after the appearance of AIDS), but then there were all the concerns about how would the cups be disposed of properly, would some Holy Communion be left in them, therefore desecrating it, etc. Fortunately, conservatism and faith prevailed.

I am looking forward to your response.

In the Risen Christ,
Pray for me, a sinner

P.S. What does 'Spasi Khristos' mean?

Alice

Bless me a sinner, Father Mark,

The answer to your question is - it depends where on the scale of "Easternness" a given BC parish is.

We are like the Anglicans with our "High (Eastern) Church" and "Low (Latin) Church" parishes.

And just when a parish like mine thinks that there is no "higher" that it can go as an Eastern parish, along comes St Elias in Brampton and shows that there still is!

Alex

Dear Father Mark,

I am only an ignorant lay person, but I can tell you that Holy Communion is warm, so yes, something (the wine?) must be warmed.

In Christ,
Alice

Dear Alice - Khristos anesti!

My question regarding the zeon is for the catholics, since the adding of warm water fell out of use in Greek Catholic parishes in the past.

Regarding the use of the spoon, many priests simple like the mouth to be opened so that it does not need to closed on the spoon.

In the Russian Old Rite, the laity are communed with three spoonfuls of the Precious Body and Blood of Our Lord, just as we as clergy take three sips fom the chalice.

Spasi Khristos -
Mark, monk and sinner.

Father, bless!

Zeon is used at my parish, and at other Byzantine Catholic parishes of which I am aware.

********************
As for babies, most babies are "no solids" communicants until such time that they are both unlikely to choke, and unlikely to spit out mushy solids.


Cheers,

Sharon

Dear Father Mark, the teplota has not fallen out of use in all Greek Catholic parishes. In fact it is being restored in more parishes with time.

Good to hear!

Hi Sharon!

When my children were babies, they never had a problem with the dissolved bread in the wine of Holy Communion.

I am interested (if we are talking about the same type of Holy Communion, please forgive my ignorance otherwise) why babies in your parish would choke on it, or spit it out. (Ofcourse in our case the spoon truly is baby sized, so maybe that helps??) I have NEVER, ever seen such a case in all my years as an Orthodox.

I am just curious. Please forgive me if I am offending you, my sister, in any way.

How many children do you have? It sounds like yours are still young. I got started right out of college, so mine are pretty old now (16 and 21 )Ofcourse, just getting them to want to go to church (despite being there EVERY Sunday as children) now is an issue in itself... ahhh..the joys of parenthood!

In the Risen Christ,
Alice

Alice,

I have 3 I can hug. 13 yo girl, 6yo boy, 17 month old boy.

Some babies have major gag reflexes. Mine don't, but all would spit out solids they found not to their liking until about 2 years old. My youngest is still in that state, so we simply don't risk it with the Lord As mentioned in another thead (I think) Father tried a bit of solids last month, and I had a heck of a time keeping the Eucharist from being profaned. (Let's just say I received one-and-a-half-times that morning...) This is a kid who will happily knock off 3/4 of a chicken breast, but none of my kids liked "squishy" stuff as toddlers.

Everybody's different, no problemo.

Best,

Sharon