www.byzcath.org Forums Faith & Christian Life Faith & Theology Did God create light?

I've been having a debate with someone. I said there is Uncreated Energy and created energy. He told me that energy cannot be created. Yet in Genesis God creates light before He creates anything else. I know that God's Uncreated Energies were involved in the creation of the universe but it seems to me that God's energies differ from physical energy.

God, of course, can create energy. Nobody else can (I've tried). Incognitus

Dear Anon:

Have you tried using "Eveready" batteries instead?

AmdG

Energy has been being spontaneoulsy created in nature continuously since the synthesis of the elements. Since the 1940's humans have been similarly engaged.

Anyone with a four year old knows about spontaneously created energy!

The rest of this article follows, but I thought this was a good answer....Bishop John asked Dr. Fran Colie, the Assistant Director of the Religious Education Department (Dr. Colie is a fireball, not afraid to speak truth)
The �image� of God� in us is our true nature and it is good, not flawed, all that is made by God is good. In the Eastern Church �grace� is called �uncreated energy� because it is God�s energy � all other energy is created energy because God is the only uncreated one. After the fall of Adam, the world created by God was thrown into chaos, making it necessary for man to struggle to bring this �image� to fruition or �likeness� by overcoming or transcending the temptations of this worldly life.

Bishop John asked Dr. Fran Colie, the Assistant Director of the Religious Education Department to field this question. Here is Dr. Colie's response: .Man is created in the "image and likeness" of God (Gen1:26). He is created with the "image" or seed of divine filiation with God and the potential to bring that "image" to the "likeness" of God by the exercise of free will.

We integrate our understanding of both the 'graced and the flawed nature of the person' as you state in your question, by accepting ourselves and our true nature which is that of �man the divine icon� made according to the archetype of man, Jesus Christ., and grow synergistically in a relationship with God. That nature may become flawed only by our free choice, but the 'image' can never be taken away. Man may choose God or remain self centered and carnal minded which limits growth in the �likeness� of God. Man is most like God when he exercises his free will to choose to become like God. Being made in the �image of God� he has the potential to become like God. This potential can never be taken away even though it might be tarnished by sin (which in essence is a conscious refusal to grow in the �likeness� of God; a denial of God.

The �image� of God� in us is our true nature and it is good, not flawed, all that is made by God is good. In the Eastern Church �grace� is called �uncreated energy� because it is God�s energy � all other energy is created energy because God is the only uncreated one. After the fall of Adam, the world created by God was thrown into chaos, making it necessary for man to struggle to bring this �image� to fruition or �likeness� by overcoming or transcending the temptations of this worldly life.

In western theology, the spiritual man is a �natural� man to whom grace has been added. Human nature (natura pura) includes the intellectual and the animal life and to this the spiritual life (the supernatural) has been added and somehow superimposed on a purely human economy. In the East, the expression, man �in the image of God� (that is, with the grace of the Spirit) defines exactly what man is by nature, �By his creation man shares the nature of God� and so charismatism is intrinsic to human nature� Evdikimov states, What the West calls supernatural-natural� is simply called �human-divine�, or created-uncreated� by Eastern authors. Consequently, for man the natural (kata physin) consists of whatever is for him a pure good: charity, faith, the virtues, gnosis, and so on. Wickedness is sin, evil thoughts the passions � all these are �against nature� (para physin). Ephram explained that it is not man�s nature which is corrupted, but his habits, and that this corruption has altered nature. Only deliverance from sin allows the appropriate use of nature�. And we read in Evagrius: �When we were created at the beginning, seeds of virtue existed naturally in us but no malice at all . . .�

found this too, but I havn't read it..
http://catholic-church.org/grace/eastern/bibli.htm
http://www.catholic-church.org/grace/
http://www.catholic-church.org/grace/ecu/te-plan-hb.htm

Hi,

Actually not.

Nuclear reactions transform matter into energy and, theoretically at least, it could also happen the other way around.

By stating that the first thing created in the Universe was light, the Book of Genesis might be doing the first statement of the Big-Bang theory.

Big-Bang. Lots and lots of light/energy and matter coming out of it in due time.

Shalom,
Memo.

Then actually yes.

Hmmmm.... I think your friend has to admit that energy can not be "created" only as far as we puny humans understand "things created."

God can "Create" anything He wants. The natural world, as we know it, and the natural of order of things, as we observe it, is but a reflection of His Creation.

The proper realm of science, I think, is to try to understand a little of how He did it and to take that knowledge and use it for some good and helpful purpose. Somehow, I think God smiles when man tries to "create" - but too often, we just seek to destroy.

I tend to think simplistically that what we observe as laws of nature are just God's gameplan in carrying out His acts of Creation. Can we or other things Created by God create energy on our own....really? Probably not. Can God Create energy? Sure, why not?!

Are the "uncreated energies" God, or are they distinct from God?

God alone is uncreated. Everything else is created by God.

Thus, the assertion that there are "energies" that are uncreated is somewhat troublesome for me. How could they be uncreated? To be uncreated is to be independent of God. I could see how these energies could be eternal, and yet created, but I do not see how they could somehow exist without being dependent on God for their existence.


Can anyone help?

I might just be misunderstanding all this, so please don't wig out at me, any of you.

LatinTrad