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Catholics should not marry Muslims, say Italian bishops

This is in the Timesonline UK edition. Wonder why they aren't carrying it here? THe Church needs to speak up, it has to stand up and help people realize what they are doing. The statements of the Vatican must be having some impact, otherwise the government wouldn't be so upset

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0%2C%2C13509-1898451%2C00.html

Churches in communion with Rome appear to be more liberal with regard to marriage between faiths, than our Orthodox brethren. For example, my understanding is that a full-scale marriage with crowning only occurs between 2 baptized trinitarian Christians among the Orthodox- no church intermarriage with Muslims, Jews, Buddhists, Mormons, Unitarians, and so on, because they are not believers in the Trinity.

If Christ enters into the marriage, how can he where both partners are not believers in Him? At least, that's some of the argument for why non-trinitarians aren't marrying Orthodox. (I wouldn't be surprised if there are exceptions to this, of course.)

We live in a world hostile to God and His Good News. The treaty between Pope Pius XI and Mussolini gave the state all of the remaining papal holdings outside of the Vatican and in return gave the Church freedom to criticize the Fascist government or any government. I.e., the Church gave away land for the freedom to speak. Now the government in Italy, as does all governments, wishes to remove the Church's freedom of speech. Has this ever been different?

"Emma Bonino, a leader of the Transnational Radical Party, accused the Vatican of seeking to affect the general election, due in April, as politicians from the Right and Left courted the Vatican to gain Catholic votes. She said that the Vatican had taken strong stances on issues such as abortion, same-sex unions, and euthanasia in violation of the 1929 Lateran Treaty between the Vatican and the Italian State. Mara Tognetti Borgogna, a sociologist at Bicocca University, Milan, said of mixed marriages: �Each case is different. It depends on the circumstances.The most critical moment usually comes when the children reach adolescence and come into conflict with one parent or both over their life choices.�

CDL

Glad to hear Cardinal Ruini address the matter. Holy Scripture is quite clear on the subject.

2nd Corinthians 6:14 Bear not the yoke with unbelievers. For what participation hath justice with injustice? Or what fellowship hath light with darkness?
2nd Corinthians 6:15 And what concord hath Christ with Belial? Or what part hath the faithful with the unbeliever?
2nd Corinthians 6:16 And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols? For you are the temple of the living God; as God saith: I will dwell in them, and walk among them; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people.
2nd Corinthians 6:17 Wherefore, Go out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing:
2nd Corinthians 6:18 And I will receive you; and I will be a Father to you; and you shall be my sons and daughters, saith the Lord Almighty.

Dear Pani,

Marriage with a Muslim man is a very serious thing. It limits one's choice, not only for now; because the person might not be devout or care at the present, but for their whole life. It also affects the choices that their children will be able to make.

My grandson is friends with a South American girl that I believe is a Christian, even though one parent is Jewish. She is going with my grandsons wealthy Saudi Arabian friend.

Now you can imagine with his 'wealth' and those (princly) Saudi good looks, that the girl must be in quite a pickle. He buys her expensive gifts and wants her to visit Saudi Arabia. He insists that life there is not the way it appears.

Her mother told her not to go, and righfully so since I have heard horror stories, and my grandson also told her not to go. The problem is not now, if they should marry. The problem is what happens later when they have children, and all of a sudden she decides she wants her daughter or daughters to see a world outside of Saudi Arabia. That is before she is set up in a marriage by her father.

Also, her Christian upbringing might start to kick in, and she might want her children as well as herself, to make choices as to what their faith will be.

In Europe though, the situation is much more serious than it is here. In certain countries, the Muslim workers, (or so I believe), are encouraged to marry local Christians. This way they can acquire their citizenship, and help Islam grow.

They have real problems, and the Church undoubtably see's it.

Zenovia

Catholics should alwaysbe discouraged from marrying non-Catholics, and definitely Muslims.

Jim, I don't know about the Orthodox praxis, but traditionally the Catholic Church has been very strict about mixed marriages.

Logos Teen

Dear Teen et al,

The Orthodox Church from the published guidelines prohibits marriage between a Christian and a Muslim. The marriage can not be blessed by the Church. The same would apply to any non-Christian and those that have not been baptised in the name of the Trinity (i.e. Mormons, Jehovahs Witnesses, etc.).

I hope this helps.

In IC XC,
Father Anthony+

Thank you, Father Anthony. Glad to see you back, too.

I don't know if the Catholic Church has traditionally had a policy of not allowing for Catholic-Muslim mixed marriages; obviously at the moment it is, at least, possible, though discouraged. I wonder what the official stance was before Modernism reared its ugly head.

Do the Orthodox Churches have anything similar to the Catholic Church's position about Christian/non-Christian mixed marriages as lacking sacramental grace? Our Church believes that these kinds of marriages are only "natural" and not "supernatural," as marriages are between two Trinitarian Christians.

I know that right up through Vatican II any time a Catholic married a non-Catholic, the non-Catholic parent was forced to sign an affadavit swearing to raise the children Catholic. I've seen this firsthand when my Scottish Presbyterian grandmother married my Sicilian Catholic grandfather...she signed it and raised my dad and his brothers Presbyterian anyway! She told me she never had any intention of following through on it. :rolleyes: Are these affadavits still part of Catholic/non-Catholic mixed marriages? Like I said, things have changed since the "New Springtime," naturally, so I don't know the current stance.

Logos Teen

Dear Logos Teen,

I am in and out depending on the workload, and this weekend was kind of light, for I am in between projects.

As far as the Orthodox Church is concerned from my read, is that no marriage has taken place sacramentally at all between and Orthodox Christian and Non-Christian, i.e. Muslim. Thus there would not be any sacramental grace for in the eyes of the church, no sacrament has taken place.

I hope this helps.

In IC XC,
Father Anthony+

Zenovia that is such a difficult situation. Even if you searched the internet and found all the articles of women tring to get out of Saudi Arabia with their children, more than likely she would say that won't happen to her. As Lawrence posted it is very clear in Scripture that this is a no no.

I just ask the Lord to put her life in his order and bring about the end to any relationship that is not of him. Sweet Jesus please put that relationship into your oder as you place her life decisions in agreement with your Word.

Also, and I think this was a rumor, the situation with Princess Di and Dotie - the guy she was with, was a Muslim - that seemed to have created a real problem for the Royals of England.

Fr. Anthony and Teen it is the same thing in the Eastern Catholic Churches. They, a Catholic and Muslim, can not be married in the Church. Especially in the Middle Eastern Churches great care must be taken.

Pani Rose