Father Michael Sopoliga - whom I do not know (though I would like to know him and I suspect we might enjoy each other's company) and of whose jurisdictional affiliation I am unaware (nor is it any business of mine) asks rhetorically whether those who advocate the absence of pews think that the remaining seats should be allocated on a Going-To-Jerusalem basis: "Do they stop to play musical chairs to see who gets the seat?" Hmmm. It's been a long time. But I can still remember Carpatho-Russian pontifical Liturgies in the days of Orestes (Chornock) and Nicholas (Elko) which included the "Hierarchal Dance" at the Little Entrance, involving some amazing criss-cross choreography, while singing "Save us, O Son of God . . . " X number of times. By any chance does anyone have an old film of this particular liturgical practice? It would be fun to see it again (maybe it's on that video of the consecration of the Johnstown Cathedral; the vintage is right). The Greeks have a different but equally elaborate choreography - still in use - for a truly solemn Hierarchal Liturgy. Quite enjoyable. Incognitus [If you're thinking that this observation has nothing to do with pews, pro or con, you are correct - it's just a pleasant memory that Father Michael's comments stimulated and that I though others might enjoy as well as myself.]
From a completely practical standpoint, as the father of a young child I hate pews. Everytime that we attend liturgy in a parish with pews, my wife and I spend the entire liturgy either wrestling with our 8 month old or out in the narthex walking around. Either way, we don't get to participate much. When there are not pews, we just put the baby on the floor in front of us, give her a toy or a book, and she spends most of the liturgy content and we can pray. At the homily, we sit on the carpet and can be perfectly comfortable and not have to wrestle the baby. I've heard many other parents say the same thing. It's interesting that few parishes without pews have 'cry rooms' (which I equally cannot stand) and that is because children in my estimation behave better and are more easily controlled. Moreover, kids like going up to the front for the entrances to kiss Father's phelonion, etc. It makes kids feel more involved.
I may not be a CEO, just a poor law student, but I am a parent, of which there are more, and I can't stand pews because they interfere with my ability to pray, to listen to the homily, and control my daughter and make her an active part of the community from an early age.
Andriy, thanks for that article. Fr. Andriy gave us a lecture from that paper during one of our diaconal classes, and at the conclusion he had us so fired up it's a good thing there was not a large church nearby with pews for us to remove...
Great points, Justin, and as a father and cleric (subdeacon) I have to completely agree with you. I have always been so much more distracted by those stupid pew kneelers banging on the floor which about shakes the icons and oil lampada off the walls, and don't notice the kids moving about hardly at all.
Even when I am reading I love to see the kids moving around, and our priest is equally amused. One will occasionally wander around the tetrapod while I am reading, but I actually like that.
Our Byzantine tradition has a liturgical and very natural sense of freedom of movement. Children pick up on that at an early age. Kids are unquestionably much more restless and confined with pews, and without them you don't have to worry about them dropping a kneeler on their pinkies and then really causing a ruckass.
Speaking of choreography, in the Synodal hierarchical Liturgy, the subdeacons have to do a switcheroo with lit trikery and dikery, crossing over to the opposite side of the Holy Doors from each other after the Gospel. This is before the Bishop comes to the solea, so the trikery and dikery are on the correct side for the Bishop to bless. This can be very interesting with the tall lit trikery/dikery depending on the level of practice of the subdeacons.
Originally posted by Diak: Speaking of choreography, in the Synodal hierarchical Liturgy, the subdeacons have to do a switcheroo with lit trikery and dikery, crossing over to the opposite side of the Holy Doors from each other after the Gospel. This is before the Bishop comes to the solea, so the trikery and dikery are on the correct side for the Bishop to bless. This can be very interesting with the tall lit trikery/dikery depending on the level of practice of the subdeacons.
Do I detect someone salivating at the thought of trick(er)y subdiaconal choreography?
What is Alex's objection to Tricky Dicky? Is Alex a diehard Nixon supporter? A well-done Hierarchal Liturgy requires a drill team of expert subdeacons. Remind me sometime to pass along the history of the heroic Proto-Subdeacon in Saint Petersburg long years ago. Incognitus
Originally posted by incognitus: But I can still remember Carpatho-Russian pontifical Liturgies in the days of Orestes (Chornock) and Nicholas (Elko) which included the "Hierarchal Dance" at the Little Entrance, involving some amazing criss-cross choreography, while singing "Save us, O Son of God . . . " X number of times. By any chance does anyone have an old film of this particular liturgical practice? It would be fun to see it again (maybe it's on that video of the consecration of the Johnstown Cathedral; the vintage is right).
If a video of this practice turns up, let me know too! I have heard oral reports of how this was done, and seen some still photographs, but am waaay too young to have seen it in person.
In addition to the two bishops mentioned above, I believe that Bishop John (Martin), of blessed memory, seems to have utilized this "pontifical dance" on occasion.
"Proto-Subdeacon" is an unword which I coined for this particular snippet of history to designate the lead subdeacon of a team of subdeacons. If there are five subdeacons, as there should be, he's the one who whispers the directions to the other four. Incognitus
Originally posted by incognitus: "Proto-Subdeacon" is an unword which I coined for this particular snippet of history to designate the lead subdeacon of a team of subdeacons. If there are five subdeacons, as there should be, he's the one who whispers the directions to the other four. Incognitus
Dear Incognitus
Now you have told us what a Proto Subdeacon is
For pities sake before we explode with curiosity [ and we all know what that did to the cat ] please tell us about the heroic Proto-Subdeacon in St Petersburg
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