www.byzcath.org Forums Faith & Christian Life Faith & Theology Western Orthodoxy

Brian,

There's really no need to point out the obvious- - -unless you're trying to advance some ulterior motive, like another discussion of the legitimacy of the Filioque. If this is what you want to do, just say so. We're all aware of the basic history of the Creed.

Logos Teen

Not at all!!! You had stated that to you it was strange that a "Western Christian" group would have the creed without the Filioque when Western-rite Orthodox parishes take the original Creed since they are part of the Orthodox Church.
I'm sorry if my previous post came off negatively. As you know, it is often hard to express nuance online.

Thanks for your explanation, Brian. I also apologize if my post came off less than charitable.

I still do think it's odd, however, that this community doesn't include the Filioque. I can understand Western Orthodox parishes not including it since they are part of the Orthodox Church; but since this group was influenced by Westerners like Luther (who accepted the Filioque), I thought it was a little strange.

Logos Teen

Dear Logos Teen,

And here I thought it was only the Orthodox that nit-picked about things such as the Filioque.

Zenovia

Well, Zenovia, that's just Brian: he's a nit-picker extreme.

Fortunately, I like nit-pickers; I am one myself.

Logos Teen

Thanks, I think

Dear Logos Teen, Brian and all nit pickers,

It seems our upbringing, (religious and societal), wraps us in a shell, and we simply can't break out of it...that is, unless one is a saint.

Hopefully the day will come, when our Lord will break that shell, and open us up. Maybe then, we will see the humanity and Christianity in all. (With the exception of those that embrace the modernist innovations, of course).

Now about the Filioque, and all innovations of the West. If one imagines themselves in the East, knowing only the Eastern Church, they will see the West as a branch of the Church, that has taken a dangerous path. A path of making innovations without an Ecumenical council, taking them down the road to (maybe), an eventual heresy.

If an Orthodox though, was to imagine himself in the Western Church, he would see himself as being the main body of the Church...knowing no other. He would understand that these small innovations were made in order to combat certain heresies that were brewing at the time. As as a part of the Western Church he would think, "what's the big deal".

Zenovia, who finds no importance in nit-picking.

All well and good, Zenovia but it really is an important thing to have consensus between East and West and the East was not consulted when those words were inserted into the Creed, the BASIC underpinning of what we believe as Orthodox. I don't see that as a small thing or nit-picking. You must understand the Orthodox perspective on that

Is there a unique perspective? Even for various postings by Orthodox here it is apparent that the answer is no.

Here's a thought, in another context, from an Orthodox theologian.

http://www.touchstonemag.com/archives/article.php?id=17-09-040-f

I think that you will find the Orthodox perspective on this most lovingly stated by Bishop +Kallistos in "The Orthodox Church" and no, i try NOT to be like some of those exclusivist Orthodox converts It was the cradle Orthodox people that were and are examples to me in the Faith and brought me to that Faith.

I know. But the quote gives such nice food for thought, that I justed wanted to get it on the board.

Well, it's much better to have nit-pickers than to have nits!
Incognitus