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I have only seen the liturgy of St. John at a Byzantine Church but I am reading my Light of Light Cathecism books and I see that the Liturgy of St. James is also used. Is there a aplace I can watch this service, I know that you can watch one of the two online but I don't know which one. By the way the Light of Life series is very good.

The Liturgy of St. James is celebrated every Sunday by the West Syriac Churches. Go into a Syro-Malankara Catholic, Maronite Catholic, or Syriac Catholic Church; or into a Syriac Orthodox or Indian Orthodox Church any Sunday and participate in this Liturgy if you wish. The Syriac Orthodox and Catholic Church have an inter-communion agreement, but I advise speaking to the celebrating priest prior to the Holy Qurbono (Divine Liturgy) if you wish to receive in the Orthodox Church. Of course you may receive at the Catholic Churches without prior permission.

The way this Liturgy is celebrated in the Byzantine Churches is similar to the Syriac, but the Syriac way is older and closer to the Jewish style. You will also notice some differences in the way a Syriac Church is arranged (no iconostasis for example)

It is probable that the Greek Archdiocese has a video of the Liturgy of Saint James, either on line or available for purchase. Since "Iakovos" in English is a chi-chi way of saying "James", the feast of Saint James was the name-day of Archbishop Iakovos, and he used to celebrate the Divine Liturgy of Saint James every year on that day - Brookline sells a booklet with the text in parallel English and Greek.

In fairness to the memory of Archbishop Iakovos, I should add that one reason for his use of that form of his name was and is the habit of many Greek-Americans whose real name is Demetrios to call themselves "James" in English. I have a good friend who insists on doing that, although he is well educated and knows better.

Incognitus

Then there was that Greek who introduced himself to me as 'Harry'.

I said, 'you mean Charalambos?'.

'Oh yes, how did you know?'

*snigger snigger*

Dear Edward,
There is also the strange phenomenon that "Panteleimon" often becomes "Peter".

Incognitus

Dear Incognitus,

But you have never heard as queer a sound as the native American tongue trying and struggling to pronounce the name Panteleimon or Pantelis!!! :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

My spouse of that name (which he is quite proud of, btw) is thus thankful that his mother and father, having the wisdom of American citizens of that homogenous period we know as the 1950's, gave him the middle name of 'Peter' on his U.S. birth certificate.

Regards,
In Christ,
Alice

We recently had photos of a Greek Catholic seminary (on this site)in the Slovak republic where the seminarians were able to see this liturgy celebrated in their chapel. Most interesting especially the way they received communion.

How was the reception different than usual?

Dear Alice,

Since I don't know anyone who speaks "the native American tongue" (actually there are several, but let's not quibble), I've never heard a speaker of any of the native American languages trying to cope with either Panteleimon or Pantelis. I have heard many people who speak American English pronounce Panteleimon with no trouble at all.

But since you raise the matter, would you care to indicate your own baptismal name? I'm still recovering from a Greek Orthodox canonist who calls himself "Lewis" (his name is Elias, in case anyone's wondering).

Good holy days to you!

Incognitus

Well Incognitus, my husband of said name would disagree with you on the various pronunciations of his name, most especially when he attended the University of Michigan. :rolleyes:

Then again, being of Greek background he may be a wee bit sensitive about pronunciations.

I have mentioned my baptismal name here a few times. It is Angeliki/Angela. Don't you think that suits me? (ONLY kidding!)

Actually, it was my paternal grandmother's name and my patron saint is the Archangel Michael. I celebrate the Feast of the Archangels in November..as per the Orthodox calendar.

I don't know of any Saint Incognitus however.

Regards,
In Christ,
Alice

We have the same thing here in Australia and New Zealand where migrants from eastern Europe give themselves names like Jimmy, Mick and Rose. They also dont give the same kind of names to their own children. I went to school with a Kevin who i found out later had a traditonal name (can't recall right now) from Italy. As Australia has moved towards a multicultural approach to the various communities the need to be be jim, Mick and Rose or anything else is lessening. The smae happened with some surnames. I worked with a lady whose surname was Weren. I knew her through church as chwerenchuk. Chook (Chuk)is a common Australian word for a chicken and for the sake of the children while they were at school the end was dropped. I dont think that people would need to do this as often unless it was clear that the name was also the word for something rude or silly in Australian English.

But you have never heard as queer a sound as the native American tongue trying and struggling to pronounce the name Panteleimon or Pantelis!!! [Roll Eyes] [Eek!] [Roll Eyes]


So funny Alice

But you have never heard as queer a sound as the native American tongue trying and struggling to pronounce the name Panteleimon or Pantelis!!! [Roll Eyes] [Eek!] [Roll Eyes]

My spouse of that name (which he is quite proud of, btw) is thus thankful that his mother and father, having the wisdom of American citizens of that homogenous period we know as the 1950's, gave him the middle name of 'Peter' on his U.S. birth certificate. [Wink]

So funny Alice

I had never heard a Polish name until I was in the Air Force and then I married one I got to go to the front of the line then . Names are so interesting for sure.

Pani Rose

Anyway, I came across an interesting link, I was just wondering what others thought, since I am not that familiar with the Malankara Syrian Church.

Liturgical Tradition of the Malankara Syrian Christians
The Liturgy of Saint James of Jerusalem
Prof. M.M.Ninan
http://www.acns.com/~mm9n/liturgy/liturgy.htm

Pani Rose

Dear Alice,
Certainly Angeliki suits you - though I shall not risk embarassing you by giving details of why I hold that opinion.

Heaven, I am given to understand, includes quite a few Saints whose Christian names are not yet known to the likes of you and me, and any one of whom might playfully call himself Saint Incognitus!

Incognitus the as-yet-unsanctified