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Dec 29th, 2019
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and while is had been claimed and hinted here that the bishops have forbidden the use of litanies and verses omitted from the common service books, no one has presented any evidence that this is the case. These are not intended to be smart-aleck or rhetorical questions. I am genuinely looking for information. Where may I find the official translations for use with the newly promulgated liturgy of the omitted verses in the antiphons? The people's book includes the concluding doxology of the prayer of the 1st antiphon, but not for the prayer of the second antiphon. Is the prayer of the second antiphon in the liturgikon? If not, where may the translation for the new liturgy be found? Ditto for the prayer of the third antiphon.
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EJK,
I believe they are being made available in a supplemental text through the Metropolitan Cantor Institute. It seems like I saw ByzKat say that some time back. You might ask Jeff about it.
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Given my rather intimate and personal knowledge of the diversity of practice that exists within the Orthodox churches in the English speaking world, I am quite confident that the new liturgy fulfills this requirement completely.
I have personally witnessed absolutely every change recommended or adopted in the new liturgy in an Orthodox parish. Thus there is nothing in it that I can see that is not in line with at least one version of Orthodox liturgical practice.
Thanks for sharing it. It confirms my commitment to following the directions of the Bishops and validates my thanksgiving to God for bringing me in my spiritual journey to the Eparchy of Parma where I can fulfill my priesthood in its eastern catholic/orthodox fullness.
Thanks! It's ashame to see the patronizing that exists in our clergy even when they know they are wrong. No wonder that our church is in steep decline and will fall even further with this debacle of a liturgy. PrJ, continue to play your violin as Rome burns. Are you really proud of an eparchy in which: 90%+ of our parishes don't celebrate vespers? 90%+ of our parishes don't celebrate matins? the vast majority of our faithful kneel on Sundays? etc., etc., etc. It's no wonder people are turning to Orthodoxy. how truly sad Monomakh
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I believe they are being made available in a supplemental text through the Metropolitan Cantor Institute. It seems like I saw ByzKat say that some time back. You might ask Jeff about it. Actually, I thought I just did ask. I was curious because I remember that same tidbit from many months back, but apparently I can not hit upon the correct search terms to locate the thread. I have been all over the MCI website, and I see nothing resembling such material, so I wonder if it was ever created. If beg the knowledgeable among you permission to ask an ignorant question that could clear much up. When the letter of promulgation refers to "this text", what text is that? Where can I lay my hands on an actual document that constitutes "this text"? Ed
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Actually, I thought I just did ask.  I don't know why I missed Jeff's post and thought you were responding to Michael's. 
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In every effort of liturgical renewal, therefore, the practice of the Orthodox brethren should be taken into account, knowing it, respecting it and distancing from it as little as possible so as not to increase the existing separation, but rather intensifying efforts in view of eventual adaptations, maturing and working together. ... Given my rather intimate and personal knowledge of the diversity of practice that exists within the Orthodox churches in the English speaking world, I am quite confident that the new liturgy fulfills this requirement completely. I have personally witnessed absolutely every change recommended or adopted in the new liturgy in an Orthodox parish. Thus there is nothing in it that I can see that is not in line with at least one version of Orthodox liturgical practice. Thanks for sharing it. It confirms my commitment to following the directions of the Bishops and validates my thanksgiving to God for bringing me in my spiritual journey to the Eparchy of Parma where I can fulfill my priesthood in its eastern catholic/orthodox fullness. PrJ, I am sure you will want to share your intimate knowledge of Orthodoxy with us!  Can you provide us with a listings of Orthodox Liturgicons that mandate such changes? It would be helpful if you organized the list according to each change. Please use the 1964 Red Book as your starting reference. I have a collection of almost everything published by almost every Orthodox and Catholic jurisdiction in the past 50 years. Apart from some really bad private books no official ones have abbreviated and rewritten the Divine Liturgy like this. Which official Orthodox Liturgicion prescribes the prayer of the First Antiphon be prayed aloud, removes the Little Litanies, and prohibits more then one verse of the Antiphons? Which official Orthodox Liturgicion prescribes that the prayers be prayed aloud after the Latin custom? I won't make a full list since you say you are intimately familiar with these customs and must already have one. Thanks in advance for sharing your list of official Liturgicons that make these changes to the Divine Liturgy. Dostojno Jest
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Given my rather intimate and personal knowledge of the diversity of practice that exists within the Orthodox churches in the English speaking world, I am quite confident that the new liturgy fulfills this requirement completely. Does the diversity of practice in the Orthodox world also extend to not having Vespers and Matins at 90%+ of their churches? If so then we Byzantines are emulating them fabulously. But something tells me that this is not the case. What was it like in the jurisdiction that you came from? Monomakh
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I could answer all of these questions with ..., but it seems to me to be contrary to the point of the Lenten Fast to be judging anyone but myself. The question I am striving to answer this Fast is -- do I pray as I should?
On that great and final Day, I will not be asked to give an account of what others have done or failed to do but only what I have done with the opportunities and privileges God has granted me.
At least during the Fast, I prefer to think and meditate on this.
Forgive.
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I could answer all of these questions with ..., but it seems to me to be contrary to the point of the Lenten Fast to be judging anyone but myself. The question I am striving to answer this Fast is -- do I pray as I should?
On that great and final Day, I will not be asked to give an account of what others have done or failed to do but only what I have done with the opportunities and privileges God has granted me.
At least during the Fast, I prefer to think and meditate on this.
Forgive. Well this is a first, but we agree on something. Your right, on judgement day we will have to explain what we have done with the opportunities and privileges that God has granted us. Of all the sins I've committed, and there are many, standing up and pointing out that 90%+ of our churches don't celebrate Vespers and Matins won't be one. Asking our leaders to follow Rome's words and return to our Orthodox roots won't be one either. But depriving the faithful of these and other services, depriving the faithful of antiphons and litanies, and not being faithful to Holy Tradition will have to be answered to. I didn't make those rules by the way. Some will say that pointing out facts is judging, well, so be it. Oppurtunties and privileges are being denied to the faithful, this may be judging, but it is undiluted truth, and that is that this is wrong, plain and simple. Since the Great Fast will preclude you from answering, I'll post again on Bright Monday, even the Gregorian calendar will get it correct this year, and we can discuss this then. Have a holy and spiritual Great Fast, Monomakh
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